Beef & Blockchain
Shaye Koester 00:02
Hey, hey, it's Shaye Koester and I'm your host for the Casual Cattle Conversations podcast where we connect you to ranchers and beef industry enthusiast who can help you build a more profitable operation and improve your lifestyle. Are you looking for a community of ranchers who support and challenge you to be more profitable and proactive? Then sign up for our monthly RancherMind events, RancherMinds, are mastermind events for ranchers to come together once a month, and find solutions for their own and the industry's challenges. Stay connected by following @cattleconvos on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter, and never miss an episode or event update by signing up for our newsletter on casualcattleconversations.com/newsletter. If you get value out of this episode, or any episode, drop a comment or tip me by using the link in the show notes. With that, let's see who our guest is today and connect you to a new resource to improve your own operation and lifestyle. Already, folks, thank you for hopping on the show today. It is great to have you on here again, you know everything I said in the little intro beforehand, please go do it. Whether that's a rating, you following me on social media, etc. I'd love to meet you. Hop on one of my RancherMind calls, those are going great. But two other things I'm going to mention quick before we hop into this episode one, please go check out my Ranching Resources page on my website. It has some different businesses and technology for you to take a look at to improve your own operation lifestyle, too. If you're looking for a public speaker at any event, whether that is entrepreneurship, podcasting, even college entrepreneurship or entrepreneurship within the beef industry, you name it or advocacy. I'm doing a few of those this year. I've really enjoyed it and I'd love to connect with you and your audience as well. But with that, today, we are visiting with Gregg Barfield. Now, Gregg does not come from a background in the beef industry but he has really become interested in and passionate about our industry, to the point where he has worked with the team to develop a company that handles blockchain technology, or, in a sense, serves as a provider for that. Now, that company is called BlockTrust. But what Gregg is going to talk about is, he is really going to share how blockchain works. Now, I'm really excited for this because I know some of the basics. I really like to, you know, just get it simplified. We're gonna ask a few other questions, dive into it a little more just to get a better grasp on what blockchain is, how it works, and what that really means for you as the cattle producer. So come along for the rest of this episode and let's see what Gregg has to share with us today. All right, Gregg. Well, thank you for joining me on the show today. I know I've been excited to talk with you about this for a while, even really before we got it nailed down that a podcast would be an opportunity for both of us. So thank you for joining me today.
Gregg Barfield 03:13
Well, thank you for inviting me. I've heard a lot about your podcast, and I'm really excited to be
Shaye Koester 03:19
Awesome. So I know that we've obviously had our chances to visit but I'd really like you to share with the audience what attracted you to the beef industry? Or where did that start?
Gregg Barfield 03:32
Well, we actually developed a blockchain based project for the International Bison Association. I have a good friend, that's the president of the Bison Association. We did that and that led me to the beef industry, which obviously is a much larger footprint than bison. And so so here I am.
Shaye Koester 03:56
Okay, do you want to talk a little bit more about your role in the industry expand on that a little more? What are you doing today, etc?
Gregg Barfield 04:05
Sure. We're software developers, okay. I didn't grow up in the beef industry. Our flagship product is a blockchain based transparency system for the beef supply chain and our goal is to add value to the producers. We feel that if producers are able to share their data on a secure, easy to use platform, they would get more they would get better value out of their out of their product.
Shaye Koester 04:48
That's really neat and I think, you know, just to give our listeners a little background, what we're really going to be talking about is Greg is going to explain what blockchain is what that technology is and what that means to producers and consumers really because, you know, it's a buzzword right now. I would say it gets brought up in a lot of different conversations. It's being brought up in the beef industry a lot as well. So I'm excited to really talk about blockchain and have you explain that to us. So, for those of you who are just listening to the audio format, Greg right now has some slides or a slideshow pulled up to walk through and explain things. So we will work through some of these visuals on the audio format. But this video recording will also be available too. I'll make sure you have a link to that. But with that, Greg, do you just kind of want to talk about, you know, what is the most simplistic definition of blockchain? Or maybe you do want to start with what the beef industry looks like, as a whole, I'm gonna kind of going to hand it over to you a little bit, because you have the best way to explain what blockchain is.
Gregg Barfield 05:54
So let me let me explain it during my slide presentation, okay, because I have a way to explain it, I think, will make more sense in light of the beef supply chain. So if it's okay with you, why don't we just start going through that?
Shaye Koester 06:08
Awesome. So with that, Greg, would you please explain, you know, what is blockchain?
Gregg Barfield 06:15
Oh, so simply put blockchain is a system of recording information in a secure fashion that can be changed, and cannot be hacked. It's what we call in this business, what we call immutable, which means it can't be changed and that's one aspect of blockchain. Another aspect is the fact that it's decentralized, which means the data is not kept on a central server. Because anytime you have data kept on a central server, then if there's a possibility that somebody can break in and hack it, it's actually capped. It's called decentralized, because it's capped on nodes, which are on computers all over the place. So it's immutable, and it's decentralized, but essentially it acts as a mechanism of trust, which means that, it's, it's a way that people can trust the data that is out there. And it's honestly, it's the reason that that cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin can retain your values, because there's a mechanism of trust that everybody knows it's true is in the middle of the transaction. So if that's there, then that means that that transaction is true. And so and so that's how the Bitcoin retains its retains its value. You know, and thank you for explaining that. But then bringing up the cryptocurrency factor. Oftentimes blockchain does get associated with cryptocurrency. But that's not saying that just because blockchain is in the beef industry, we will have to operate on cryptocurrency, correct? The two are separate. Yes, that is correct. A blockchain is the underlying technology of all cryptocurrencies but it's also used for a lot of other purposes. Mainly, it's a great use in the in any kind of supply chain, whether that be anything from diamonds, to cars, to anything. Anything that's an asset, it needs to be tracked, this keeps an immutable record of that. And that can't be changed. You can only add records to a blockchain, you can't edit the records or take records off. So it's sort of like, it's sort of like accounting, whereas you can't change a general ledger entry. If you if you want to, I mean, you can't erase a general ledger entry. But if you want to change it, you would have to make an adjusting entry. So that's what you do with with Blockchain. You always know that the records are accurate, and you got an accurate paper trail with, with all the records.
Shaye Koester 09:03
Well, awesome. And now that you've kind of provided that basis, would you go through some of these slides for us and really talk to us and explain it in that fashion?
Gregg Barfield 09:12
Sure. So, the slide is up right now is the beef supply chain, I know a lot of your listeners already know this, but it helps me explain it. So, if you can bear with me, over on the left side of the screen, you have your cow calf operations and then it goes through the backgrounder or stockers then on to the feedlots and from the feedlots it goes to the processor and then to the retailer, all along the way. In these what I call silos are the different sectors of the supply chain. You have data that gets accumulated here, because each of these these sectors has some very good software? The problem is that that the supply chain is so fragmented, especially down here at the ranch and farm grazing operations, that there's no secure, easy platform in order to allow them to share data. So whatever data gets accumulated in the center usually stays in the center, when in such a huge industry, I believe it's probably one of the few industries in the world where you're not able to share data from one end of the supply chain all the way to the other end. That's important, because for instance, a lot of value happens here at the processor. But yet, that whole process starts way down here on the ranch, but usually, when that cow leaves the ranch they don't ever see it again. They have no idea how it graded out or anything. So carcass data is important to the ranch. Another reason is here at the feedlot where a lot of these feeders are buying cattle, from the ranches, and they don't have any verifiable individual data to use to make their purchasing decisions. And with a lot of these private supply chains, these value chains, like you know Walmart and Costco and Wendy's or McDonald's, they they're looking for very specific characteristics of the cattle that they want to purchase. And without the verifiable data, it's hard to find those cattle. Then here at the supermarket, it's really, really kind of a no brainer, because the consumers are looking for a way to tell that story. They want a story with their beef. Well, without a platform like this, it's really impossible to tell the story because there's no way to break into this very fragmented system. So the problem is that the data is not visible between different sectors of the supply chain or to the consumer. So what companies like ours and other companies out there have developed are software agnostic livestock transparency platforms that are built on blockchain. So here in this diagram, the ball in the middle represents what we do and the icons on the outside represent the different sectors of the beef supply chain? Well, we sort of act like the I like to call it the superhighway of transactions. Whereas we don't build the software for any of these sectors out here. But we act as the sort of traffic cops to make sure the data gets shared with the parties that have permission to see the data. So you might say that's great, but why would you use blockchain? Okay? The reason you use blockchain is because these days with the internet, and social media, and, you know, news everywhere, anyone can print, or post whatever they want to promote their personal agenda. And there's not just a problem with this industry. It's a problem worldwide and in Indian industry, it's information overload, and it gets out there and then it gets spread around and then people start believing it. So blockchain actually acts as a mechanism of trust, which means that if it goes on the blockchain, it's a mechanism that that people agree that the information is true. So what exactly is blockchain? So blockchain is an electronic ledger that provides a detailed history of interactions between parties that indicate can be altered, as we explained before. That means it's immutable. It's also decentralized, which means it's not sitting on one server that that can be hacked, okay, so that's what it is. Think of a ledger like a spreadsheet, where it is just rows and columns of data? That's in electronic format. Now, to be fair, I'd like to explain all sort of like what blockchain is not. Okay, so there won't be any misconceptions. It's not meant to be a replacement for a traditional database. It's a platform to store transactions. It's not a truth machine. If it was a truth machine we'd put all the politicians out of business, right? False information can be put on a blockchain. We can't control that. But, you know, if you put any false information on there, it's going to stay on forever, and it's likely that somebody up and down the chain will call you out on it. Okay, it's not a standalone system, either there needs to be an overlying sort of control mechanism to turn, you know, jibberish into, you know, language that people can understand, which is the reason Bitcoin can't work without these programs like Coinbase. Some of these programs that actually act as the wallet for the, for the crypto coins.
Shaye Koester 15:30
Yeah, thank you for explaining that I think it's important to really know how secure this is and you know, exactly what is it and how does that work.
Gregg Barfield 15:41
Right. So that's, that's what I'm going to explain here. Now, this is probably the most geeky part of my presentation here. So if you, if you bear with me, Blockchain is literally a chain of blocks. Okay, so you see if you can, for those of the that are watching on the screen, these are actually blocks of data that would be represented in a blockchain. So you basically have five fields here and each block, okay, you have, so you start out with, let's say, let's relate this to cattle. So you scan in your tag, okay, so that data from this ear tag scan goes into this block, and it's block zero and it's what's called the Genesis block, because it's the first block. okay? Then you have an index, that's your first field and it's a sequential number, across all the box blocks, then you have a timestamp. Timestamp is very important, because all the blocks are arranged in chronological order and if they're out of order, they won't work. Okay, then you have your data and we can put whatever data we want on here. We have just a little bit of data in this example an ID, latitude, longitude, but you could put, you know, video, you know, all any kinds of data you want, in the data section. Then you have what's called a hash, which is a very long, alphanumeric number that you that you would never ever be able to remember. Which is the part that makes this secure, because you put it to work, you have that hash, and then the next block has its own hash, but also has the previous hash, they then take the block all the way down the chain. When each one of these blocks get updated, all of the blocks in the node automatically gets updated. So every node has its own copy of the entire blockchain. Now we'd like to say when you talk about privacy, is that this was this is what's called a private blockchain. Okay. I don't want people to think that it's sort of like the internet, whereas your data is just out there. Okay? There's different types of blockchain and this is called a private or permissioned blockchain. So you have to have permission to be on the blockchain, unlike a public blockchain like, Bitcoin, is that anybody can can use that. So this is a private blockchain, where you have to have a username and password. And, you have to have the proper permissions to get on it. And it's not like the Internet where it's one big blockchain okay, you could have multiple block chains, like you could have your own little blockchain like you have, for instance, the feed yard you like to use in a packer you like to use. Well, you could have just you and the feedyard and the packer, all three of you in your own little blockchain, okay. It doesn't have to be, you know, the whole world to see if you don't want. It's whoever you want to see it, can can see it. Now, do you have any questions on that?
Shaye Koester 19:10
I was just gonna say, you know, thank you. I mean, I appreciate you going through and really showing these visuals and then like, I'm just going to emphasize that if you are on the audio, please find that video link. Because these visuals help it make a lot more sense. But, you know, being able to show, you know, the individual blocks and how those play into nodes, but really, I appreciate you talking about how, you know you're in charge of your information like you do have a say it's not where the whole world has access to that information just because it's on a blockchain because I know security is one of the concerns that many people have about sharing their information through sectors.
Gregg Barfield 19:49
That's right. It's probably the most prevalent question we get every day is privacy and security, and rightly so. And I want to, you know, that's why I want make sure everybody's comfortable with this. But it's an opt in system. I mean, you agree to share your data in return for, for getting data back, because you're going to get greater value out of it, so our whole goal is to provide greater value for the producers. So how is it used in the livestock industry, we're mainly in supply chain functions, by now, you know, making the data visible to the participants in the beef supply chain and showing the data. Traceability issues, CattleTrace, is a is a big partner of ours. They're on a mission to make sure that disease traceability is in place, in case there's a disease or disease outbreak. They like us because we provide some value to the cattle tag and without that, a lot of producers can't find a good reason to, to put the tags on. So we're great partners, and really proud of our relationship with CattleTrace and these days, everyone's trying to tell a story, you know, and so this gives a gives a mechanism to tell the story, the the data is there. If you're part of this, then you're able to share your data as much or a little bit as you want. Now, future uses of livestock industry, we'll have to say that, honestly, these things are actually going on right now. They're there, they're in the future, because they're, you know, for banking practices, but they're actually being used right now. Asset verification, there's financial institutions out there, that are using this to verify their assets. For instance, if you lend money to a rancher, and they use the cattle for collateral, then the bank wants to know that the cattle are real, that they're there. And so if they're, if they have tags on them, and they're tracked on a blockchain, then that gives them some peace of mind and can give, you know, for instance, better terms on the financing. The second one here, environmental practices is huge these days, because of, you know, the big buzzword in the industry sustainability. So everybody is working on these ways to track sustainability. You hear about carbon credits, and you hear about sustainable practices, well, all that has to be tracked. So if data is put onto the blockchain, you know, that the data is real, and that, you know that a lot of the claims have more validity, because because they're being tracked. So if you have claims that have value, you know, whether that be sustainability claims, or grass fed, or no hormones, or antibiotic free or whatever, and there's value attached to those claims, you're going to have claims coming out of the woodwork, so to speak, right? So, if you have so many claims out there, visually, people say, you know, blah, blah, blah, you know, I've heard that before. So they need to be tracked, using a mechanism that everybody trusts. And that's why blockchain is a good mechanism for that. You know, we hear of tokenisation. Um, this is what usually makes people's eyes glaze over when I start talking about it. It's a little bit out there, but you're hearing more and more about if you've heard of NFT's probably NF T's are very popular these days. The way to explain it tokenisation is sort of like when you when you go into a casino, and they give you chips that are representative of your money. Okay? So they don't want a bunch of money stacked up all over the over the place, so they give you these chips, but the chips represent real money. Okay, so there are tokens, okay, same way with this is that we could turn a, let's just say an animal into a token. Okay. And then you can do things with it, like trade it, you can invest in it, you can invest in, let's say you want to invest in 10% each and on the ranch. Okay. And then you could we that's called investing in a token, and then you could track the animal all the way up with the supply chain and realize the gains at the at the end. Okay, that's one. That's one way to think about it. But there's companies out there that are making cattle into NFT's right? And, and then tokenizing those and verifying them with those methods really exciting. I do think it's the way of the future so the bottom line is, for the rancher, you know, why should I get involved in this? Well, the main thing is that we feel that we can give the rancher greater market access to some of these private supply chains if he's on because the supply chains are looking for better data attached to the assets that they purchase which is to cattle. Okay, so adding verifiable data to the cattle will you know, equal greater value. So that's the bottom line. In addition to that, though, you can get carcass data back from the other end of the chain, which can help you in your improve your practices. We feel that, you know, as more and more people start using this, the quality is going to go up. The ones that will benefit are the are the producers because they they will have a platform to be able to show the, their their hard work. And I mean, they're doing great things with genetics and health and nutrition and a lot of times that goes unnoticed. And so we're giving them a platform to be able to show that data and to get noticed in the market. So we've talked about privacy and security, the main thing is that it's an opt in system. We feel that we want producers to know what they're getting into. And, if they're interested they can get on board with this, you know, they have complete control over who sees their data in most of these systems and in portals or control panels. We've you know, we make sure privacy and security are our the upfront every day because that's what most people are concerned about. So people usually say how do I get involved. And the first thing we always say is tag your cattle. That's the most important thing we we found out that only about 5% of, of the cattle are showing up in feedyards with electronic IDs. And we feel that if they use platforms like this, then there will be more inclined to tag their cattle and add value to that cattle tag. So that's the presentation. Do you have any questions?
Shaye Koester 28:18
I just want to thank you for going through that. I mean, I appreciate the visual aid and being able to understand, you know, I'm a more visual person. So being able to really see what blockchain looks like and seeing, you know, what it means for ranchers. I really think you did a great job saying that, you know, this is a method of being able to add more value to your herd because data sells and that it's secure and safe. And that ultimately, the rancher has control of who gets to see their data, depending on you know, what organization, they're a part of and how they access this blockchain technology. Really, it's their choice of where it goes. So I appreciate you putting an emphasis on that and explaining that. I guess I do have a few questions for you. Now, what would you say is kind of holding back the adoption of this technology? Because other industries are using it? So what do you think is holding back the beef industry from adopting this more?
Gregg Barfield 29:14
Well, as you know, the beef industry is a very conservative industry. I love it, I'm fascinated by it. I love the people they're just hard working honest people. But a little bit slow to change you know, a little bit you know, not wanting to adopt new technologies and I think to answer your question about what's holding them back is just probably being being a little bit leery about these things. We talked about data privacy and security and you know, some ranchers are worried about government interference and they don't want their data, quote unquote, out there. So that's why we put security and privacy at the forefront of everything we do as in I think all of these companies in our industry do because they know they have to.
Shaye Koester 30:20
Awesome now, when we look at adopting this and moving into it as we do start to make those changes, and hopefully people jump on the sooner rather than later. But what mindset does the industry need to have to make this technology the most effective and beneficial for them?
Gregg Barfield 30:39
Well, I think to sum it up, I think they're going to have to be forward thinking. I think they need to not be so afraid of change and they have to be oriented around the value of data. You know, people tell me every day, there's no way anybody's going to use this. And I simply respond by saying, you know, you might be right, maybe they won't, but I bet you that their sons and daughters will. I bet you their grand children will because that's just the way everything is going. Look around, people are staring at their phones, all day long in restaurants and everywhere. It's just the way we do things. We make our airline reservations. We do our banking online, we it's just something that I think people not only, like, but they expect, and I think as you know, if we're talking about sustainability, then you know, there's a lot of aspects. One aspect of sustainability is how do you make sure that the future generations want to be in this business? I think if the future generations are, so if they are used to using data, then we have to make data part of this thing, too.
Shaye Koester 32:09
I think those are excellent points. And I do think, you know, as technology becomes more common, yes, the beef industry is slower to adapt to it, it seems like but as it becomes more common and more used, I would hope that the adoption of those technologies come sooner. So, you know, what do you think will happen to the value of these premiums as more and more cattle get on the system? Or get on premium systems? Like, what do you think the future of the industry looks like, as far as value added programs go?
Gregg Barfield 32:40
Well, I think you know, let's be clear. We're not going to trump the supply and demand economics. Okay, that's not going to happen. But I think what we will see is that the quality will go up. I don't see that if you have bad quality, let's say animals, you're not going to want to put them on the system. You know, I think that, you know, if you're going to put something on the system for everybody to see, it's probably going to be better quality because you're sort of competing with with the good quality out there. Um, one example I like to use and this this kind of I think is a good analogy use this is is is Carfax. So you know what Carfax is? So folks used to sell cars all the time, buy and sell cars. And, we didn't know if the car had been wrecked. We didn't know if it had a bad engine. You know, there's nothing but these days, we would never buy a car without checking the Carfax. Okay. And we even to the point where if you found a car that you liked, but he didn't have Carfax with it, you would be leery that there might be something wrong with it. Okay, so that's just the way you do business. Okay, you don't buy a car without checking the Carfax? Well, I think that that's just what this is. I think this is sort of like Carfax for cows. Right? So this will provide the data that's associated with that asset. Okay. And when people are selling cars they're not, they're said buying and selling cars back down. They're not worried about, you know, the privacy of the beyond the previous owner of that car or anything. They just care about the car, okay. They just care about the data on the car. So I think that as more and more people start to use the system it's just going to become normal. And it's going to become just the way you do business. You know, you go and you buy cattle and you need some data attached to them. That's how you know how good they are. You know, and so it's I'm hoping that this is the way that people do business in the future.
Shaye Koester 35:21
Well, awesome. I mean, I think you covered every question I had for you. But do you have anything else you would like to add for the audience? Or hit on again? You know, this last these last couple minutes, or this last question or prompt is up to you to really share anything else you'd like to add.
Gregg Barfield 35:41
Well, again, that I appreciate you inviting me on your podcast. I just want to say I hope people aren't scared of blockchain. I hope they don't think that it's all about Bitcoin or anything, it's really just a way to record transactions, and it happens in the background, that you won't even know it's there. But I hope you can feel secure, that it's there protecting your data and making everybody know that the data is accurate. Because again, these guys and gals out there, they work so hard in there, and they're such good good folks. And, and we just want to provide a good platform for them to show off their hard work and show the world that they're producing a good quality product. I hope that you get involved. I hope these producers get involved because we can bring value to the industry.
Shaye Koester 36:42
Well, awesome. Thank you very much, Gregg, for hopping on. It was great to have you on the show today.
Gregg Barfield 36:46
Thank you, Shaye and if y'all need anything, be sure to reach out.
Shaye Koester 36:50
And that's a wrap on that one folks. Thank you for tuning in. And thank you Gregg for joining me on the show. Remember to go follow @cattleconvos on social media to engage in more conversation about this topic. Have a great day.
